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Postby Bigun » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:31 pm

Hardcoregirl wrote:I always get pissy when people call me a satanist. Because to be a satanist you have to first buy into all that other bullshit. I don't think there's a god, and even if I did believe in some sort of creator, I would not buy into the bullshit about satan. Thats about controlling people with fear. Oh wait, thats what the major religions are about.


That I find 100 fold more respectable.
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Postby Hardcoregirl » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:58 pm

Bigun wrote:
Hardcoregirl wrote:I always get pissy when people call me a satanist. Because to be a satanist you have to first buy into all that other bullshit. I don't think there's a god, and even if I did believe in some sort of creator, I would not buy into the bullshit about satan. Thats about controlling people with fear. Oh wait, thats what the major religions are about.


That I find 100 fold more respectable.


I'm not a nonbeliever for the shock value of it, or to piss people off. Its not that I'm angry at god for something so I decided to tell him to fuck off. I knew so many kids in high school that were atheist, not because it was the more logical choice, but just to make their parents mad, or to try to stick out in a crowd.

Thats just retarded. Satanists should just grow up already.
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Postby Mercurygriffin » Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:43 pm

Just to clue you in, satanists almost always don't belive in a god of any kind either. I just really like the ideology and principles. Also you have to remeber that much of religion is symbolism. Satanists use the name as a reflection of our disagreement with the way "God" and the majority of christians persecute based on some of the most retarded of basis. Satanism also suggests that you use logic and rational thought over faith, because faith usually is made up of superstitions that are out dated. So, I don't have to believe in anything if I don't want and I don't have to adhear to rules based on a book writen before science.

Chao

P.S. I don't hate anyone based on religion. I do however hope that in any given argument that it has more substance than "But the ( Bible, Torah, Quaran, or any other religious text) says that is wrong."
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Postby Bigun » Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:55 pm

Mercurygriffin wrote:Just to clue you in, satanists almost always don't belive in a god of any kind either. I just really like the ideology and principles. Also you have to remeber that much of religion is symbolism. Satanists use the name as a reflection of our disagreement with the way "God" and the majority of christians persecute based on some of the most retarded of basis. Satanism also suggests that you use logic and rational thought over faith, because faith usually is made up of superstitions that are out dated. So, I don't have to believe in anything if I don't want and I don't have to adhear to rules based on a book writen before science.

Chao


Why even label it? That's just blatant, untamed human nature.
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Postby Hardcoregirl » Fri Mar 09, 2007 4:17 pm

I shouldn't really claim to know what satanists believe, I'm just going on my assumptions that are probably mostly colored by christians. I am assuming a 'satanist' is a worshipper of Satan, as in the fallen angel, as in the prince of darkness etc. I guess there are probably 20 different factions of satanism too and I don't know much at all about it. But if its not about worshipping Satan/Lucifer, and not about being "shocking" perhaps it has some valid points, I don't know.
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Postby Mercurygriffin » Fri Mar 09, 2007 5:48 pm

Bigun wrote:
Mercurygriffin wrote:Just to clue you in, satanists almost always don't belive in a god of any kind either. I just really like the ideology and principles. Also you have to remeber that much of religion is symbolism. Satanists use the name as a reflection of our disagreement with the way "God" and the majority of christians persecute based on some of the most retarded of basis. Satanism also suggests that you use logic and rational thought over faith, because faith usually is made up of superstitions that are out dated. So, I don't have to believe in anything if I don't want and I don't have to adhear to rules based on a book writen before science.

Chao


Why even label it? That's just blatant, untamed human nature.


Because as I said, I like the principals. Just for fun you should read up on some of our ideas. You might have a differant opinion then. not to say you will convert, maybe just understand where I'm comming from.

Hardcoregirl wrote:I shouldn't really claim to know what satanists believe, I'm just going on my assumptions that are probably mostly colored by christians. I am assuming a 'satanist' is a worshipper of Satan, as in the fallen angel, as in the prince of darkness etc. I guess there are probably 20 different factions of satanism too and I don't know much at all about it. But if its not about worshipping Satan/Lucifer, and not about being "shocking" perhaps it has some valid points, I don't know.


Not all satanists worship satan but some do and perform ritual (which I think is nothing more than getting all focused on an idea which can be a good thing). Actually "satan" is a title given to those that disagree with "God". Lucifer is the fallen angle who lost his standings with God and was sent below. Now I look at all of that as a really good STORY. The bible has many wonderful texts that if one takes properly can be very enlightining. And yeah, the kids that do it for shock should have to be steralized. Anything worth beliving should be of the whole, not just for shits an giggles. And I wholely feel that "sins" are just the things that somepeople do and feel guilt for. I like to "sin". In fact, some of my most rewarding experiances have come from "sinning".

In a nut shell, here are the basics. The nine satanic statments: (not commandments)

1. Satan represents indulgence instead of abstinence!

2. Satan represents vital existence instead of spiritual pipe dreams!

3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom instead of hypocritical self-deceit!

4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it instead of love wasted on ingrates!

5. Satan represents vengeance instead of turning the other cheek!

6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible instead of concern for psychic vampires!

7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his “divine spiritual and intellectual development,â€
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Postby gothic_spleen » Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:18 pm

Mercurygriffin wrote:[
9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!






i like that....that is a good point,you can not have one without the other.
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Postby alazar » Mon Mar 12, 2007 12:57 am

This is probably only the second or third time I have ever posted on here, because I hate forums. But I heard about this thread and had to come enjoy it for myself. For those of you who know me, no offense. For those of you who don't, take it however you want.

I for one do not believe in religion, anything having to do with religion, religious beliefs and especially not any figure in religion, particularly god, jesus or lucifer.

Unlike most, if not all of you. I have studied religion, religious history, ancient history and cultural history. So my first question is for everyone.

When did mythology become fact? As I hope you all do realize that all religions are still part of mythology, no matter how much you want them to be real. They simply are not, especially christianity. I mean seriously, has anyone on here read the bible from cover to cover, or simply just listened to some redneck preachers interpretation of it. The book is so full of absurdities and contradictions it's clear that it was written by some of the worst writers in history.

I have read it from cover to cover. I had to as a child and for school. Along with numerous other religious books from various religions. I have yet to find any thing resembling reality or showing any proof of reality. Hell, actual recorded history does not even support any religion in anyway. In christianity, the only shred of evidence is the fact that some(not all) of the people in it actually lived, just no where near when the book says they did. Or it simply leaves out particualars.

Example: Jesus lived. Just not as the book says. His name was not jesus or jesus christ. This is a name given to him in the year 335CE by the catholic church to boost his supposed power. His actual name was yeshua and he lived 100 years before the book says he did. Now notice the difference here, jesus(greek name), yeshua(hebrew name). he was jewish? As well, recorded history of him tells the same story as the jews tell of him. He was nothing more then a low level profit that never did anything of importance. But good use of the name by the catholics.

What I'm trying to get at here is writers will boost things, such as names or numbers or titles to make the story sound better, this in no way makes it real.

On another note. There is a particular religion which absorbs most of the south that I find particularly disgusting. Baptist. If any of you are, take this how you wish. This is the absolute most absurd religion I have ever laid eyes upon. I like to call it the redneck religion. A group that actually believes they are right and would down a religion such as the catholic religion. I do have to say these people just piss me off.

First thing a baptist needs to know is that there religion is even more bogus then christianity. I have actually heard these people claim they are right and the catholics are wrong. As well as various other rediculous claims, such as scientist making up dinosaurs.

Fist thing, the baptist church was founded in 1638. The catholic church is just slightly older, I don't know, by about 1300 years. The baptist religion was formed when man named roger williams broke off from the catholic church and formed what we now call a cult, which he called baptist. In doing so he stole all the catholic beliefs, changed what he wanted or that suited him and baptist religion was born. So in my opinion there is absolutely no way that your religion could even come close to being right.

Dinosaurs, made up by scientist or found by people whom actually have more than a 6th grade education. You see learning things like reading are important for you. Then you could read your own bullshit book and learn for yourself how stupid it really is.

A formal education is a good thing.

can't wait for the responses!
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Postby Bigun » Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:23 am

alazar wrote:When did mythology become fact? As I hope you all do realize that all religions are still part of mythology, no matter how much you want them to be real. They simply are not, especially christianity. I mean seriously, has anyone on here read the bible from cover to cover, or simply just listened to some redneck preachers interpretation of it. The book is so full of absurdities and contradictions it's clear that it was written by some of the worst writers in history.


Really? Mind pointing out a few contradictions? And before you do remember one thing, this book was originally written in Greek, Hebrew, and Sanskrit, so if your going to be drawing out contradictions, be sure they are not tied to the limitations of the English language.

On another note. There is a particular religion which absorbs most of the south that I find particularly disgusting. Baptist. If any of you are, take this how you wish. This is the absolute most absurd religion I have ever laid eyes upon.


Really.... look into Mormonism sometime.
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Postby Hardcoregirl » Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:23 am

Bigun wrote:
Really.... look into Mormonism sometime.


I don't understand how one christian can say another form of christianity is really any more insane than the other. Mormons are christians and many of their beliefs are from the King James version of the bible. The book of mormon doesn't really add anything crazy to their religion, in fact from what I can remember its mostly about wars, etc. My sons dad is mormon and yeah I think they are nutty, but the things they believe aren't any more outlandish than that which other christians believe.
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Postby Bigun » Mon Mar 12, 2007 1:02 pm

Hardcoregirl wrote:
Bigun wrote:
Really.... look into Mormonism sometime.


I don't understand how one christian can say another form of christianity is really any more insane than the other. Mormons are christians and many of their beliefs are from the King James version of the bible. The book of mormon doesn't really add anything crazy to their religion, in fact from what I can remember its mostly about wars, etc. My sons dad is mormon and yeah I think they are nutty, but the things they believe aren't any more outlandish than that which other christians believe.


I'm at work and I can't get into the complexities of it at this moment, and I can later. But you are dead wrong, they add plenty to their table: Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine and Covenants... just to name the 3 main one's. I'll get into why I severely dislike that group later.
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Postby Hardcoregirl » Mon Mar 12, 2007 1:23 pm

Bigun wrote:
Hardcoregirl wrote:
Bigun wrote:
Really.... look into Mormonism sometime.


I don't understand how one christian can say another form of christianity is really any more insane than the other. Mormons are christians and many of their beliefs are from the King James version of the bible. The book of mormon doesn't really add anything crazy to their religion, in fact from what I can remember its mostly about wars, etc. My sons dad is mormon and yeah I think they are nutty, but the things they believe aren't any more outlandish than that which other christians believe.


I'm at work and I can't get into the complexities of it at this moment, and I can later. But you are dead wrong, they add plenty to their table: Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine and Covenants... just to name the 3 main one's. I'll get into why I severely dislike that group later.


Yes I know they have various books, but I'm saying that theres not really anything any more outlandish than the bible in them. I don't like them either, but they aren't any worse than the rest of christianity.
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Postby alazar » Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:17 pm

Bigun wrote:
alazar wrote:When did mythology become fact? As I hope you all do realize that all religions are still part of mythology, no matter how much you want them to be real. They simply are not, especially christianity. I mean seriously, has anyone on here read the bible from cover to cover, or simply just listened to some redneck preachers interpretation of it. The book is so full of absurdities and contradictions it's clear that it was written by some of the worst writers in history.


Really? Mind pointing out a few contradictions? And before you do remember one thing, this book was originally written in Greek, Hebrew, and Sanskrit, so if your going to be drawing out contradictions, be sure they are not tied to the limitations of the English language.

On another note. There is a particular religion which absorbs most of the south that I find particularly disgusting. Baptist. If any of you are, take this how you wish. This is the absolute most absurd religion I have ever laid eyes upon.


Really.... look into Mormonism sometime.



Limitations of the English language. Excuses, excuses, excuses. Every christian has an excuse for every fact presented to them. To bad it does not help you prove anything. By the way how much of religous history have you gone to school for?

Want contradictions and absurdities. Here are just a few. Actually, slightly over a thousand of them for you, since you asked.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/abs/long.htm

And please note that there is even a list of bullshit from the mormon bible since you brought it up.
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Postby Bigun » Tue Mar 13, 2007 7:25 am

alazar wrote:Limitations of the English language. Excuses, excuses, excuses. Every christian has an excuse for every fact presented to them. To bad it does not help you prove anything. By the way how much of religous history have you gone to school for?

Want contradictions and absurdities. Here are just a few. Actually, slightly over a thousand of them for you, since you asked.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/abs/long.htm

And please note that there is even a list of bullshit from the mormon bible since you brought it up.


It must be easy to just paste a link to a site where biased readers submit what they had found. And trying not to sound like a complete jackass here, but the English language is severely limited. You can say you love someone.... let's say of the opposite gender, and you would have to explain exactly what you meant. So many different ways that love can be interpreted. That said, Mr. King James was idiotic enough to try to do a word-by-word translation. Therefore some words are not fully translated to their full meaning. It's not me that created this severely handicapped language, so don't call it an excuse.

And I don't want to get into a pissing contest about who studied more than who, but I did end up doing religious studies for 3 years, I never made it a major or even a minor in college, but I did do a little homework.

Also don't think I'm incapable of having things explained to me. I've sat down with one person in particular, and discussed with him the specifics of a few issues I had with Catholicism. After talking for about an hour or so, I had a different outlook. Still have a few issues, but that involves the actual people, not the belief.

As far as your statements that Jesus Christ's real name was yeshua.... how exactly does that make him any less of who he was before? Does that defunct the whole Christian belief system? Will it crumble simply because the name was translated into another language? Or mayhap our problem is that we decided to worship on Sundays, in light of the day of the pagan Sun God's day? Pointing out things that don't make much of a difference in our basic belief's won't change anything. If your going to make me think, give me something to chew on.

To hardcoregirl:
I started to assemble some information for you regarding what I'd get back to you about, but it was far, far, far to freaking much to post on here, roughly estimated at about 5 or so pages worth of information. If you like, next time we both are at temple, we can sit down and actually conversate about said issue. If not..... *shrug*
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Postby alazar » Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:09 pm

Damn, you don't give up do you. Oh well, sheeple never do. As the world grows and goes through changes it will eventually leave behind it's mistakes. Then things like religion will just be another long forgotten memory. Probably will take a few thousand years for that to happen, though the growth of the world and it's intelligence level does take time. Till then believe what you wish, I just ask that you and the rest of the sheeple keep it to yourselves. I ask this because I am tired of various religions trying to push there beliefs on me and the rest of the world. Enough cultures around the world have been corrupted. I mean really, have you ever had a atheist knock on your door and preach to you. I do understand that your religion tells you to spread the word. Although telling a undeveloped culture that if they don't convert to your beliefs they will burn in a horrid place called hell is a bit much. Thats not spreading the word. Thats forcing your beliefs on someone else through fear. It's also a not welcome annoyance to your neighbors and friends, as well as those you talk to in forums.

Nice talking to you,

Peace
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Postby Bigun » Wed Mar 14, 2007 7:21 am

alazar wrote:I do understand that your religion tells you to spread the word. Although telling a undeveloped culture that if they don't convert to your beliefs they will burn in a horrid place called hell is a bit much.


Meh, at this point I'll settle just for peace. It's not like you haven't heard this crap before, why do you need to hear it again, if you reject the information before, how would mentioning it two-thousand times more help any. Even the bible says to mention it twice then leave it alone.

As far as hell goes, eh... I've adopted the Seventh Day Adventist's view on that matter.... which is a whole other explanation all together.
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Postby ophelia » Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:58 pm

Bigun wrote:That said, Mr. King James was idiotic enough to try to do a word-by-word translation.
Wow, this really cracked me up. King James wasn't a "Mr." or a translator. He paid people to warp the Bible in order to forward his own political agenda.

However, my favorite thing about the "Word" as most Christians know it is the language. Hearing Jesus speak to his followers in Elizabethan English sends happy shivers down my spine. Of course, that could be because I'm a Renaissance/Shakespeare scholar nazi, but it still makes for pretty reading. Too bad I'm not so much into mythology... I may find some of the Bible rationally palatable.

Fun thread, though. It’s nice to see some intelligent debate again.
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Postby iblis » Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:58 pm

ophelia wrote:Too bad I'm not so much into mythology... I may find some of the Bible rationally palatable.

it's not too bad after a few drinks, but it has been known to leave certain individuals intellectually constipated - at least for the 60 or 70 odd years it takes for them to get over it.
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Postby Bigun » Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:44 am

Die thread.. DIE!
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Postby junkie christ » Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:07 pm

:spanishinquisition: :spanishinquisition:
O(+>
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